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Wikipedia

Shadow banning

Shadow banning, also called stealth banning, hellbanning, ghost banning, and comment ghosting, is the practice of blocking or partially blocking a user or the user's content from some areas of an online community in such a way that the ban is not readily apparent to the user, regardless of whether the action is taken by an individual or an algorithm. For example, shadow-banned comments posted to a blog or media website would be visible to the sender, but not to other users accessing the site.

The phrase "shadow banning" has a colloquial history and has undergone some usage evolution. It originally applied to a deceptive sort of account suspension on web forums, where a person would appear to be able to post while actually having all of their content hidden from other users. More recently, the term has come to apply to alternative measures, particularly visibility measures like delisting and downranking.[1]

By partly concealing, or making a user's contributions invisible or less prominent to other members of the service, the hope may be that in the absence of reactions to their comments, the problematic or otherwise out-of-favour user will become bored or frustrated and leave the site, and that spammers and trolls will be discouraged[2] to continue their unwanted behavior or create new accounts.[3][4]

History

In the mid-1980s, BBS forums including Citadel BBS software had a "twit bit" for problematic users[3][5] which, when enabled, would limit the user's access while still allowing them to read public discussions; however, any messages posted by that "twit" would not be visible to the other members of that group.[3][6]

The term "shadow ban" is believed to have originated with moderators on the website Something Awful in 2001, although the feature was only used briefly and sparsely.[3]

Michael Pryor of Fog Creek Software described stealth banning for online forums in 2006, saying how such a system was in place in the project management system FogBugz, "to solve the problem of how do you get the person to go away and leave you alone". As well as preventing problem users from engaging in flame wars, the system also discouraged spammers, who if they returned to the site would be under the false impression that their spam was still in place.[4] The Verge describes it as "one of the oldest moderation tricks in the book", noting that early versions of vBulletin had a global ignore list known as "Tachy goes to Coventry",[7] as in the British expression "to send someone to Coventry", meaning to ignore them and pretend they do not exist.

A 2012 update to Hacker News introduced a system of "hellbanning" for spamming and abusive behavior.[8][9]

Early on, Reddit implemented a similar feature, initially designed to address spam accounts.[10] In 2015, Reddit added an account suspension feature that was said to have replaced its sitewide shadowbans, though moderators can still shadowban users from their individual subreddits via their AutoModerator configuration.[11] A Reddit user was accidentally shadow banned for one year in 2019, subsequently they contacted support and their comments were restored.[12]

A study of tweets written in a one-year period during 2014 and 2015 found that over a quarter million tweets had been censored in Turkey via shadow banning.[13] Twitter was also found, in 2015, to have shadowbanned tweets containing leaked documents in the US.[14][15]

Craigslist has also been known to "ghost" a user's individual ads, whereby the poster gets a confirmation email and may view the ad in their account, but the ad fails to show up in the appropriate category page.[16]

WeChat was found in 2016 to have banned, without notice, posts and messages that contain certain keywords.[10][17]

In 2017 the phenomenon was noticed on Instagram, with posts which included specific hashtags not showing up when those hashtags were used in searches.[18][19][20]

Controversies

Political controversies

"Shadow banning" became popularized in 2018 as a conspiracy theory when Twitter shadow-banned Republicans.[21] In late July 2018, Vice News found that several supporters of the US Republican Party no longer appeared in the auto-populated drop-down search menu on Twitter, thus limiting their visibility when being searched for; Vice News alleged that this was a case of shadow-banning.[21][22] After the story, some conservatives accused Twitter of enacting a shadowban on Republican accounts, a claim which Twitter denied.[23] However, some accounts that were not overtly political or conservative apparently had the same algorithm applied to them.[24] Numerous news outlets, including The New York Times, The Guardian, Buzzfeed News, Engadget and New York magazine, disputed the Vice News story.[23][25][26][27][28][29] In a blog post, Twitter said that the use of the phrase "shadow banning" was inaccurate, as the tweets were still visible by navigating to the home page of the relevant account.[30] In the blog post, Twitter claims it doesn't shadow ban by using "the old, narrow, and classical" definition of shadow banning.[31] Later, Twitter appeared to have adjusted its platform to no longer limit the visibility of some accounts.[32] In a research study that examined more than 2.5 million Twitter profiles, it was discovered that almost one in 40 had been shadowbanned by having their replies hidden or having their handles hidden in searches.[33][34]

On December 8, 2022, the second thread of the Twitter Files—a series of Twitter threads based on internal Twitter, Inc. documents shared by owner Elon Musk with independent journalists Matt Taibbi and Bari Weiss—addressed a practice referred to as "visibility filtering" by previous Twitter management. The functionality included tools allowing accounts to be tagged as "Do not amplify", and under "blacklists" that reduce their prominence in search results and trending topics. It was also revealed that certain accounts, such as the far-right Libs of TikTok, had been given a warning stating that decisions regarding them should only be made by Twitter's Site Integrity Policy, Policy Escalation Support (SIP–PES) team—which consists primarily of high-ranking officials. The functions were given by Musk and other critics as examples of "shadow banning".[35][36][37]

Conspiracy theories

A form of conspiracy theory has become popular in which a social media content creator suggests that their content has been intentionally suppressed by a platform which claims not to engage in shadow banning.[38] Platforms frequently targeted by these accusations include Twitter,[3] Facebook,[26] YouTube and Instagram.[38]

To explain why users may come to believe they are subject to "shadow bans" even when they are not, Elaine Moore of the Financial Times writes:[38]

Like Uber drivers and Deliveroo couriers, social media influencers are at the mercy of algorithms. This makes them perfect fodder for conspiracy theories. It also makes sense that influencers would be baffled by any sudden decrease in engagement and spooked by changes that might jeopardise the brand deals they sign. Instead of believing that their own popularity is waning, some cling to the idea that shadowbans are a disciplinary measure that is used against creators who do not warrant an outright ban from a platform.

See also

References

  1. ^ Leerssen, Paddy. "An End to Shadow Banning? Transparency rights in the Digital Services Act between content moderation and curation". osf.io: 3. doi:10.31219/osf.io/7jg45. Retrieved 2022-12-11.
  2. ^ Thompson, Clive (29 March 2009). . Wired magazine. Archived from the original on 2015-08-05. Retrieved 6 July 2014.
  3. ^ a b c d e Cole, Samantha (31 July 2018). "Where Did the Concept of 'Shadow Banning' Come From?". Motherboard. Retrieved 1 August 2018.
  4. ^ a b Robert Walsh (12 January 2006). Micro-ISV: From Vision to Reality. Apress. p. 183. ISBN 978-1-4302-0114-4. So one of the things we did in FogBugz to solve the problem of how do you get the person to go away and leave you alone is, well, you take their post and make it invisible to everyone else, but they still see it. They won't know they've been deleted. There's no one fanning their flame. You can't get into a flame war if no one responds to your criticism. So they get silenced and eventually just go away. We have several ways of telling if they come back, and it's been proven to be extremely, extremely effective. Say a spammer posts to your board and then they come back to check if it's still there, and they see it—to them it's still there—but no one else sees it, so they're not bothered by it.
  5. ^ Atwood, Jeff (4 June 2011). . Coding Horror blog. Archived from the original on 30 December 2011. Retrieved 17 December 2011.
  6. ^ "Manual installation of Citadel using source code and the command line client - Citadel.org". www.citadel.org. Retrieved 20 December 2020.
  7. ^ Bohn, Dieter (16 February 2017). "One of Twitter's new anti-abuse measures is the oldest trick in the forum moderation book". The Verge. Retrieved 17 February 2017.
  8. ^ Leena Rao (18 May 2013). "The Evolution of Hacker News". TechCrunch. Retrieved 10 August 2014.
  9. ^ "Can the democratic power of a platform like Hacker News be applied to products?". Pando. 4 December 2013. Retrieved 1 August 2018.
  10. ^ a b Ruan, Lotus; Knockel, Jeffrey; Ng, Jason Q.; Crete-Nishihata, Masashi (30 November 2016). "One App, Two Systems: How WeChat uses one censorship policy in China and another internationally - The Citizen Lab". The Citizen Lab. Retrieved 29 April 2017.
  11. ^ Shu, Catherine (November 11, 2015). "Reddit Replaces Its Confusing Shadowban System With Account Suspensions". TechCrunch. Retrieved 16 September 2017.
  12. ^ Gerken, Tom (2019-04-11). "The Redditor who accidentally spent a year talking to himself". BBC News. Retrieved 2023-03-13.
  13. ^ Tanash, Rima S.; Chen, Zhouhan; Thakur, Tanmay; Wallach, Dan S.; Subramanian, Devika (1 January 2015). "Known Unknowns". Proceedings of the 14th ACM Workshop on Privacy in the Electronic Society. WPES '15. New York, NY, USA: ACM. pp. 11–20. doi:10.1145/2808138.2808147. ISBN 9781450338202. S2CID 207229086.
  14. ^ Ohlheiser, Abby (30 October 2015). "Tweets are disappearing on Twitter. Why?". The Washington Post. ISSN 0190-8286. Retrieved 29 April 2017.
  15. ^ Pearson, Jordan (October 19, 2015). "Is Twitter Censoring a Blockbuster Report on US Drone Assassinations?". Motherboard. Retrieved 26 July 2017.
  16. ^ Weedmark, David. "How to Prevent Ghost Posting on Craigslist". Chron.com.
  17. ^ Doctorow, Cory (December 2, 2016). "China's We Chat "shadow-bans" messages with forbidden keywords, but only for China-based accounts". Boing Boing. Retrieved 29 April 2017.
  18. ^ Lorenz, Taylor (7 June 2017). "Instagram's "shadowban," explained: How to tell if Instagram is secretly blacklisting your posts". Mic Network Inc. Retrieved 4 November 2017.
  19. ^ Wong, Kristin (April 23, 2017). "How to See If Your Instagram Posts Have Been Shadowbanned". Lifehacker. Retrieved 4 November 2017.
  20. ^ "Photographers Claim Instagram is 'Shadow Banning' Their Accounts". PetaPixel. 28 March 2017. Retrieved 26 April 2017.
  21. ^ a b Romano, Aja (6 September 2018). "How hysteria over Twitter shadow-banning led to a bizarre congressional hearing". Vox.
  22. ^ Thompson, Alex (26 July 2018). "Twitter appears to have fixed "shadow ban" of prominent Republicans like the RNC chair and Trump Jr.'s spokesman". Vice News. Retrieved 15 August 2018.
  23. ^ a b Stack, Liam (26 July 2018). "What Is a 'Shadow Ban,' and Is Twitter Doing It to Republican Accounts?". The New York Times.
  24. ^ Eordogh, Fruzsina (31 July 2018). "Why Republicans Weren't The Only Ones Shadow Banned On Twitter".
  25. ^ Warzel, Charlie (July 26, 2018). "Twitter Isn't Shadow-Banning Republicans. Here's Why". BuzzFeed News. Retrieved 13 February 2019.
  26. ^ a b Feldman, Brian (25 July 2018). "Twitter Is Not 'Shadow Banning' Republicans". Intelligencer. Retrieved 13 February 2019.
  27. ^ Wilson, Jason (27 July 2018). "What is 'shadow banning', and why did Trump tweet about it?". The Guardian. ISSN 0261-3077. Retrieved 13 February 2019.
  28. ^ Swapna Krishna (26 July 2018). "Twitter says supposed 'shadow ban' of prominent Republicans is a bug". Engadget. Retrieved 13 February 2019.
  29. ^ Laura Hazard Owen (27 July 2018). "Twitter's not "shadow banning" Republicans, but get ready to hear that it is". Nieman Lab. Retrieved 13 February 2019.
  30. ^ "Setting the record straight on shadow banning". Twitter. Retrieved 8 September 2018.
  31. ^ "Shedding Light on Shadowbanning". Center for Democracy and Technology. 26 April 2022. p. 37. Retrieved 2022-12-11.
  32. ^ Alex Thompson (26 July 2018). "Twitter appears to have fixed search problems that lowered visibility of GOP lawmakers". Vice. Retrieved 28 March 2019.
  33. ^ Le Merrer, Erwan; Morgan, Benoit; Trédan, Gilles (2020-12-09). "Setting the Record Straighter on Shadow Banning". arXiv:2012.05101 [cs.SI].
  34. ^ Nicholas, Gabriel (2022-04-28). "Shadowbanning Is Big Tech's Big Problem". The Atlantic. Retrieved 2022-12-09.
  35. ^ Shapero, Julia (8 December 2022). "Former NYT columnist Bari Weiss releases 'Twitter Files Part Two'". The Hill. Retrieved 9 December 2022.
  36. ^ Urquhart, Evan (2022-12-09). "The Anti-Trans Hate Account That Bari Weiss Says Is Yet Another Right-Wing Voice Censored by Twitter". Slate Magazine. Retrieved 2022-12-09.
  37. ^ "The Twitter Files, Part Two, Explained". Gizmodo. 2022-12-09. Retrieved 2022-12-09.
  38. ^ a b c Moore, Elaine (13 March 2022). "The truth about 'shadowbanning' is more complicated than influencers think". Financial Times. Retrieved 12 June 2022.


shadow, banning, also, called, stealth, banning, hellbanning, ghost, banning, comment, ghosting, practice, blocking, partially, blocking, user, user, content, from, some, areas, online, community, such, that, readily, apparent, user, regardless, whether, actio. Shadow banning also called stealth banning hellbanning ghost banning and comment ghosting is the practice of blocking or partially blocking a user or the user s content from some areas of an online community in such a way that the ban is not readily apparent to the user regardless of whether the action is taken by an individual or an algorithm For example shadow banned comments posted to a blog or media website would be visible to the sender but not to other users accessing the site The phrase shadow banning has a colloquial history and has undergone some usage evolution It originally applied to a deceptive sort of account suspension on web forums where a person would appear to be able to post while actually having all of their content hidden from other users More recently the term has come to apply to alternative measures particularly visibility measures like delisting and downranking 1 By partly concealing or making a user s contributions invisible or less prominent to other members of the service the hope may be that in the absence of reactions to their comments the problematic or otherwise out of favour user will become bored or frustrated and leave the site and that spammers and trolls will be discouraged 2 to continue their unwanted behavior or create new accounts 3 4 Contents 1 History 2 Controversies 2 1 Political controversies 2 2 Conspiracy theories 3 See also 4 ReferencesHistoryIn the mid 1980s BBS forums including Citadel BBS software had a twit bit for problematic users 3 5 which when enabled would limit the user s access while still allowing them to read public discussions however any messages posted by that twit would not be visible to the other members of that group 3 6 The term shadow ban is believed to have originated with moderators on the website Something Awful in 2001 although the feature was only used briefly and sparsely 3 Michael Pryor of Fog Creek Software described stealth banning for online forums in 2006 saying how such a system was in place in the project management system FogBugz to solve the problem of how do you get the person to go away and leave you alone As well as preventing problem users from engaging in flame wars the system also discouraged spammers who if they returned to the site would be under the false impression that their spam was still in place 4 The Verge describes it as one of the oldest moderation tricks in the book noting that early versions of vBulletin had a global ignore list known as Tachy goes to Coventry 7 as in the British expression to send someone to Coventry meaning to ignore them and pretend they do not exist A 2012 update to Hacker News introduced a system of hellbanning for spamming and abusive behavior 8 9 Early on Reddit implemented a similar feature initially designed to address spam accounts 10 In 2015 Reddit added an account suspension feature that was said to have replaced its sitewide shadowbans though moderators can still shadowban users from their individual subreddits via their AutoModerator configuration 11 A Reddit user was accidentally shadow banned for one year in 2019 subsequently they contacted support and their comments were restored 12 A study of tweets written in a one year period during 2014 and 2015 found that over a quarter million tweets had been censored in Turkey via shadow banning 13 Twitter was also found in 2015 to have shadowbanned tweets containing leaked documents in the US 14 15 Craigslist has also been known to ghost a user s individual ads whereby the poster gets a confirmation email and may view the ad in their account but the ad fails to show up in the appropriate category page 16 WeChat was found in 2016 to have banned without notice posts and messages that contain certain keywords 10 17 In 2017 the phenomenon was noticed on Instagram with posts which included specific hashtags not showing up when those hashtags were used in searches 18 19 20 ControversiesPolitical controversies Shadow banning became popularized in 2018 as a conspiracy theory when Twitter shadow banned Republicans 21 In late July 2018 Vice News found that several supporters of the US Republican Party no longer appeared in the auto populated drop down search menu on Twitter thus limiting their visibility when being searched for Vice News alleged that this was a case of shadow banning 21 22 After the story some conservatives accused Twitter of enacting a shadowban on Republican accounts a claim which Twitter denied 23 However some accounts that were not overtly political or conservative apparently had the same algorithm applied to them 24 Numerous news outlets including The New York Times The Guardian Buzzfeed News Engadget and New York magazine disputed the Vice News story 23 25 26 27 28 29 In a blog post Twitter said that the use of the phrase shadow banning was inaccurate as the tweets were still visible by navigating to the home page of the relevant account 30 In the blog post Twitter claims it doesn t shadow ban by using the old narrow and classical definition of shadow banning 31 Later Twitter appeared to have adjusted its platform to no longer limit the visibility of some accounts 32 In a research study that examined more than 2 5 million Twitter profiles it was discovered that almost one in 40 had been shadowbanned by having their replies hidden or having their handles hidden in searches 33 34 On December 8 2022 the second thread of the Twitter Files a series of Twitter threads based on internal Twitter Inc documents shared by owner Elon Musk with independent journalists Matt Taibbi and Bari Weiss addressed a practice referred to as visibility filtering by previous Twitter management The functionality included tools allowing accounts to be tagged as Do not amplify and under blacklists that reduce their prominence in search results and trending topics It was also revealed that certain accounts such as the far right Libs of TikTok had been given a warning stating that decisions regarding them should only be made by Twitter s Site Integrity Policy Policy Escalation Support SIP PES team which consists primarily of high ranking officials The functions were given by Musk and other critics as examples of shadow banning 35 36 37 Conspiracy theories A form of conspiracy theory has become popular in which a social media content creator suggests that their content has been intentionally suppressed by a platform which claims not to engage in shadow banning 38 Platforms frequently targeted by these accusations include Twitter 3 Facebook 26 YouTube and Instagram 38 To explain why users may come to believe they are subject to shadow bans even when they are not Elaine Moore of the Financial Times writes 38 Like Uber drivers and Deliveroo couriers social media influencers are at the mercy of algorithms This makes them perfect fodder for conspiracy theories It also makes sense that influencers would be baffled by any sudden decrease in engagement and spooked by changes that might jeopardise the brand deals they sign Instead of believing that their own popularity is waning some cling to the idea that shadowbans are a disciplinary measure that is used against creators who do not warrant an outright ban from a platform See alsoBan law Block Internet Deplatforming Internet censorship Kill file Section 230 Shunning Terms of service Twitter suspensions Usenet Death PenaltyReferences Leerssen Paddy An End to Shadow Banning Transparency rights in the Digital Services Act between content moderation and curation osf io 3 doi 10 31219 osf io 7jg45 Retrieved 2022 12 11 Thompson Clive 29 March 2009 Clive Thompson on the Taming of Comment Trolls Wired magazine Archived from the original on 2015 08 05 Retrieved 6 July 2014 a b c d e Cole Samantha 31 July 2018 Where Did the Concept of Shadow Banning Come From Motherboard Retrieved 1 August 2018 a b Robert Walsh 12 January 2006 Micro ISV From Vision to Reality Apress p 183 ISBN 978 1 4302 0114 4 So one of the things we did in FogBugz to solve the problem of how do you get the person to go away and leave you alone is well you take their post and make it invisible to everyone else but they still see it They won t know they ve been deleted There s no one fanning their flame You can t get into a flame war if no one responds to your criticism So they get silenced and eventually just go away We have several ways of telling if they come back and it s been proven to be extremely extremely effective Say a spammer posts to your board and then they come back to check if it s still there and they see it to them it s still there but no one else sees it so they re not bothered by it Atwood Jeff 4 June 2011 Suspension Ban or Hellban Coding Horror blog Archived from the original on 30 December 2011 Retrieved 17 December 2011 Manual installation of Citadel using source code and the command line client Citadel org www citadel org Retrieved 20 December 2020 Bohn Dieter 16 February 2017 One of Twitter s new anti abuse measures is the oldest trick in the forum moderation book The Verge Retrieved 17 February 2017 Leena Rao 18 May 2013 The Evolution of Hacker News TechCrunch Retrieved 10 August 2014 Can the democratic power of a platform like Hacker News be applied to products Pando 4 December 2013 Retrieved 1 August 2018 a b Ruan Lotus Knockel Jeffrey Ng Jason Q Crete Nishihata Masashi 30 November 2016 One App Two Systems How WeChat uses one censorship policy in China and another internationally The Citizen Lab The Citizen Lab Retrieved 29 April 2017 Shu Catherine November 11 2015 Reddit Replaces Its Confusing Shadowban System With Account Suspensions TechCrunch Retrieved 16 September 2017 Gerken Tom 2019 04 11 The Redditor who accidentally spent a year talking to himself BBC News Retrieved 2023 03 13 Tanash Rima S Chen Zhouhan Thakur Tanmay Wallach Dan S Subramanian Devika 1 January 2015 Known Unknowns Proceedings of the 14th ACM Workshop on Privacy in the Electronic Society WPES 15 New York NY USA ACM pp 11 20 doi 10 1145 2808138 2808147 ISBN 9781450338202 S2CID 207229086 Ohlheiser Abby 30 October 2015 Tweets are disappearing on Twitter Why The Washington Post ISSN 0190 8286 Retrieved 29 April 2017 Pearson Jordan October 19 2015 Is Twitter Censoring a Blockbuster Report on US Drone Assassinations Motherboard Retrieved 26 July 2017 Weedmark David How to Prevent Ghost Posting on Craigslist Chron com Doctorow Cory December 2 2016 China s We Chat shadow bans messages with forbidden keywords but only for China based accounts Boing Boing Retrieved 29 April 2017 Lorenz Taylor 7 June 2017 Instagram s shadowban explained How to tell if Instagram is secretly blacklisting your posts Mic Network Inc Retrieved 4 November 2017 Wong Kristin April 23 2017 How to See If Your Instagram Posts Have Been Shadowbanned Lifehacker Retrieved 4 November 2017 Photographers Claim Instagram is Shadow Banning Their Accounts PetaPixel 28 March 2017 Retrieved 26 April 2017 a b Romano Aja 6 September 2018 How hysteria over Twitter shadow banning led to a bizarre congressional hearing Vox Thompson Alex 26 July 2018 Twitter appears to have fixed shadow ban of prominent Republicans like the RNC chair and Trump Jr s spokesman Vice News Retrieved 15 August 2018 a b Stack Liam 26 July 2018 What Is a Shadow Ban and Is Twitter Doing It to Republican Accounts The New York Times Eordogh Fruzsina 31 July 2018 Why Republicans Weren t The Only Ones Shadow Banned On Twitter Warzel Charlie July 26 2018 Twitter Isn t Shadow Banning Republicans Here s Why BuzzFeed News Retrieved 13 February 2019 a b Feldman Brian 25 July 2018 Twitter Is Not Shadow Banning Republicans Intelligencer Retrieved 13 February 2019 Wilson Jason 27 July 2018 What is shadow banning and why did Trump tweet about it The Guardian ISSN 0261 3077 Retrieved 13 February 2019 Swapna Krishna 26 July 2018 Twitter says supposed shadow ban of prominent Republicans is a bug Engadget Retrieved 13 February 2019 Laura Hazard Owen 27 July 2018 Twitter s not shadow banning Republicans but get ready to hear that it is Nieman Lab Retrieved 13 February 2019 Setting the record straight on shadow banning Twitter Retrieved 8 September 2018 Shedding Light on Shadowbanning Center for Democracy and Technology 26 April 2022 p 37 Retrieved 2022 12 11 Alex Thompson 26 July 2018 Twitter appears to have fixed search problems that lowered visibility of GOP lawmakers Vice Retrieved 28 March 2019 Le Merrer Erwan Morgan Benoit Tredan Gilles 2020 12 09 Setting the Record Straighter on Shadow Banning arXiv 2012 05101 cs SI Nicholas Gabriel 2022 04 28 Shadowbanning Is Big Tech s Big Problem The Atlantic Retrieved 2022 12 09 Shapero Julia 8 December 2022 Former NYT columnist Bari Weiss releases Twitter Files Part Two The Hill Retrieved 9 December 2022 Urquhart Evan 2022 12 09 The Anti Trans Hate Account That Bari Weiss Says Is Yet Another Right Wing Voice Censored by Twitter Slate Magazine Retrieved 2022 12 09 The Twitter Files Part Two Explained Gizmodo 2022 12 09 Retrieved 2022 12 09 a b c Moore Elaine 13 March 2022 The truth about shadowbanning is more complicated than influencers think Financial Times Retrieved 12 June 2022 Retrieved from https en wikipedia org w index php title Shadow banning amp oldid 1185968615, wikipedia, wiki, book, books, library,

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